Were they giving people 50 years in prison for it back then too?
p0w3n3d 6 hours ago [-]
In Poland during the Soviet occupation (1945-1989) people were beaten and jailed for having a copier that would be used for copying magazines and brochures
FromHoiPolloi 2 hours ago [-]
I'd argue it was a vassal state, not occupied (per se) at least from the 1950's onwards. Yes, the soviet troops did station in Poland, but the beatings were administered by other Polish citizens.
arjie 4 hours ago [-]
The sentences are pretty crazy but what’s with the strange understatement.
> One fired an AR-15 at the police, which goes beyond legitimate protest into inciting violence (and maybe even deliberate provocation)
The accurate statement is that he shot and wounded a police officer who he intentionally targeted according to his own testimony (where he claims he did so because he thought the cop was going to shoot his guys).
> Signs you're a dangerous terrorist: using Signal, moving zines
The accurate statement is: “hiding zines that could be considered evidence of affiliation at the request of your arrested wife”.
Listen, the sentences seem politically motivated. They’re quite long. But if you joined a protest group where the organizer shoots a policeman and you’ve all got weapons at home and then you tell people to move the material you have at home that indicates you’re part of the group then I think the convictions are pretty accurate.
This is pretty out there stuff. And I’m not going to give the benefit of the doubt to the guy who yells “get to the rifles” then gets to the rifles and shoots a policeman that he could have been ‘potentially inciting violence’ by shooting. He committed violence. And hiding the facts here does not make me sympathetic.
> One fired an AR-15 at the police, which goes beyond legitimate protest into inciting violence (and maybe even deliberate provocation)
Sounds like attempted murder for a start rather than incitement or provocation. Or worse, given there was a crowd.
copper-float 4 hours ago [-]
Careful, accurately portraying these people's crimes will likely get you downvoted and flagged, unfortunately. It's sad, but there's likely people here who support what happened.
I think the sentences are a bit harsh, but understandable: this kind of behavior can't be normalized. In the last couple years, violence has become the norm against others just because you disagree with them, and that's sick. Violence is never the answer.
To the downvoters, I'd love to get a real discussion and talk instead of just burying comments you disagree with.
Arodex 3 hours ago [-]
If you want a discussion, here it is:
>this kind of behavior can't be normalized
What happened to the Jan 6 rioters?
Ashli Babbitt received military funeral honors for what?
Discuss: “Conservatism consists of exactly one proposition: There must be in-groups whom the law protects but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect.”
What is the intent of the 2nd amendment? It allows citizens to beat arms, but for what purpose?
Arodex 3 hours ago [-]
>if you joined a protest group where the organizer shoots a policeman and you’ve all got weapons at home and then you tell people to move the material you have at home that indicates you’re part of the group then I think the convictions are pretty accurate.
Oh, tell that to the president of the United States and half of Congress and half of the Senate (and half of the country). Remind me what was their reaction and actions after the pardon of Jan 6 rioters?
armchairhacker 2 hours ago [-]
The Jan 6 rioters were convicted and given similarly long sentences. Certainly Trump doing something doesn’t make it valid.
Arodex 30 minutes ago [-]
Well, if he did it and there was no opposition, it certainly makes it "valid". Where exactly has it been made invalid? Has anyone done anything to make it invalid? Aren't they free, and can they do it again?
And the slush fund for the Jan 6 rioters is just suspended, not canceled. It will come back.
like_any_other 1 hours ago [-]
They were given similarly long sentences, despite shooting zero people.
postpawl 4 hours ago [-]
[dead]
secretsatan 1 hours ago [-]
Don’t forget shipping people to foreign concentration camps for having tattoos.
jeromie 5 hours ago [-]
The ability of Texas to adhere so intensely to the idea of radical individualism while also being wholly committed to fascism at a policy level has always confused me.
When I studied Texas history in University, the textbook opened with a sentence along the lines of "Texas Government has always been characterized by incompetence and nepotism", and through that lens, I filed many of the absurdities (e.g. Greg Abbott's entire career and the "free speech area" on my university campus) under that bucket.
A couple decades haves since passed and my view has changed to see the openly racist institutions, targeted policing and zero-sum "satesmanship" at both local and state levels that forego core democratic values for "winning" (or at least lining the pockets of your donors) as something more jaded and sociopathic.
There are a lot of truly good, smart people in Texas, yet it's been an fairly openly fascist state for decades. Coming from the Bay Area and having lived in a lot of places, I've never felt like I lived in a police state more than in the DFW metroplex, although when visiting family in Northern CA, CAMP operations in Mendocino County come as a close second in terms of authoritarian vibes.
I was so confused with how many people from the valley openly aligned and invested in such a deeply corrupt state in the 2000s. Elon was unsurprising given his fashy incel leanings, but Apple's choice to build the Austin campus floored me. An office in a state where your female employees don't have reproductive rights? How do you endorse that?
You can't just look past the political rot that has defined Texas for generations with the excuse that you can buy a "Keep Austin Weird" sticker at H.E.B. The people in Austin and across the state advocating for a better future and an accountable government deserve a shoutout, but man, if you wanted to see the writing on the wall for American Democracy, all you needed to do was look at Texas anytime between 1996 and now.
It's sad because it really is beautiful country full of decent people, but it's blatantly and unjustifiably corrupt, and diametrically opposed to the core American values that it attaches to it's lifted, 9-tom, 1/2"-longer-than-the-same-model-sold-in-every-other-state pick 'em up truck, and it's gamed so hard that the people in the state will never undo it.
Texas was the test case.
krn1p4n1c 2 hours ago [-]
Texas is where a large section of the founders of the Confederacy fled to once it was clear the war was lost. It’s harbored their bigotry and ideology.
You’re right about it being the test case. Having one of the largest state populations meant that it helped drive textbook curation for elementary/HS education. Smaller red states that didn’t have the population or budget to define their own textbooks would use Texas’.
rekabis 7 hours ago [-]
Anyone who values democracy is automatically an anti-fascist.
Democracy is _inherently_ anti-fascist.
SpaceNugget 1 hours ago [-]
If there is a large group of people who use a term like "anti-fascist" as a tag line it no longer is a literal representation of the words. Just like how you wouldn't say that a guy rolling coal in a lifted pickup with a confederate flag and an AR mounted in the window who calls himself a "freedom fighter" is literally fighting for freedom.
Otherwise you will just be talking past people who are interpreting it to mean something else. Which of course you are free to do if you don't think what you are trying to say has enough value to be worth avoiding the miscommunication.
Even though I am commited to resisting "fascism" in all it's forms,the people convicted were definitly working themselves up to do something even worse.
For me there crime was to be undisaplined and they did not understand there responsibilitys while armed, which is unexcusable.
If they realy wanted to engage in armed struggle against fascists, then there are plenty of places where they could voulenteer
to fight irregular mercenary forces hired and equiped by companys and governments to destroy populations that have the missfortune to live on top of some oil or other extractable resource, but what they did was cosplay bieng a revolutionary in a suberban environment, and no doubt had plans to hook up for a few drinks at the club later.
These people made the classic, fascist, mistake of thinking in terms of a hiarchical
relationship of rights, and forgot , that everybody has rights, even a dumb ass junior cop who goes where he's told, while for all anyone knows is fielding texts from his wife ,promising that he will take the van in and get the brakes checked.
A decade ago, reading Linux Journal would get you flagged as being an extremist : https://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/4rp5l6/nsa_classifie...
> One fired an AR-15 at the police, which goes beyond legitimate protest into inciting violence (and maybe even deliberate provocation)
The accurate statement is that he shot and wounded a police officer who he intentionally targeted according to his own testimony (where he claims he did so because he thought the cop was going to shoot his guys).
> Signs you're a dangerous terrorist: using Signal, moving zines
The accurate statement is: “hiding zines that could be considered evidence of affiliation at the request of your arrested wife”.
Listen, the sentences seem politically motivated. They’re quite long. But if you joined a protest group where the organizer shoots a policeman and you’ve all got weapons at home and then you tell people to move the material you have at home that indicates you’re part of the group then I think the convictions are pretty accurate.
This is pretty out there stuff. And I’m not going to give the benefit of the doubt to the guy who yells “get to the rifles” then gets to the rifles and shoots a policeman that he could have been ‘potentially inciting violence’ by shooting. He committed violence. And hiding the facts here does not make me sympathetic.
https://www.nbcdfw.com/news/local/sentencing-for-8-accused-o...
Sounds like attempted murder for a start rather than incitement or provocation. Or worse, given there was a crowd.
I think the sentences are a bit harsh, but understandable: this kind of behavior can't be normalized. In the last couple years, violence has become the norm against others just because you disagree with them, and that's sick. Violence is never the answer.
To the downvoters, I'd love to get a real discussion and talk instead of just burying comments you disagree with.
>this kind of behavior can't be normalized
What happened to the Jan 6 rioters?
Ashli Babbitt received military funeral honors for what?
Discuss: “Conservatism consists of exactly one proposition: There must be in-groups whom the law protects but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect.”
What is the intent of the 2nd amendment? It allows citizens to beat arms, but for what purpose?
Oh, tell that to the president of the United States and half of Congress and half of the Senate (and half of the country). Remind me what was their reaction and actions after the pardon of Jan 6 rioters?
And the slush fund for the Jan 6 rioters is just suspended, not canceled. It will come back.
When I studied Texas history in University, the textbook opened with a sentence along the lines of "Texas Government has always been characterized by incompetence and nepotism", and through that lens, I filed many of the absurdities (e.g. Greg Abbott's entire career and the "free speech area" on my university campus) under that bucket.
A couple decades haves since passed and my view has changed to see the openly racist institutions, targeted policing and zero-sum "satesmanship" at both local and state levels that forego core democratic values for "winning" (or at least lining the pockets of your donors) as something more jaded and sociopathic.
There are a lot of truly good, smart people in Texas, yet it's been an fairly openly fascist state for decades. Coming from the Bay Area and having lived in a lot of places, I've never felt like I lived in a police state more than in the DFW metroplex, although when visiting family in Northern CA, CAMP operations in Mendocino County come as a close second in terms of authoritarian vibes.
I was so confused with how many people from the valley openly aligned and invested in such a deeply corrupt state in the 2000s. Elon was unsurprising given his fashy incel leanings, but Apple's choice to build the Austin campus floored me. An office in a state where your female employees don't have reproductive rights? How do you endorse that?
You can't just look past the political rot that has defined Texas for generations with the excuse that you can buy a "Keep Austin Weird" sticker at H.E.B. The people in Austin and across the state advocating for a better future and an accountable government deserve a shoutout, but man, if you wanted to see the writing on the wall for American Democracy, all you needed to do was look at Texas anytime between 1996 and now.
It's sad because it really is beautiful country full of decent people, but it's blatantly and unjustifiably corrupt, and diametrically opposed to the core American values that it attaches to it's lifted, 9-tom, 1/2"-longer-than-the-same-model-sold-in-every-other-state pick 'em up truck, and it's gamed so hard that the people in the state will never undo it.
Texas was the test case.
You’re right about it being the test case. Having one of the largest state populations meant that it helped drive textbook curation for elementary/HS education. Smaller red states that didn’t have the population or budget to define their own textbooks would use Texas’.
Democracy is _inherently_ anti-fascist.
Otherwise you will just be talking past people who are interpreting it to mean something else. Which of course you are free to do if you don't think what you are trying to say has enough value to be worth avoiding the miscommunication.